If you’re a Marmalead user and want to get some insight into how to use it for maximizing your Etsy SEO, this interview with Gordon and Richie from Marmalead will probably clear some things up for you. This is a condensed version of the Q&A they did for my Etsy SEO facebook group.
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all right so let's get started because I know you guys have a limited amount of time and thank you so much for doing this I really appreciate it in course and I will say that I love Gordon Ritchie and I will say I love Ritchie and Gordon because I always say Gordon and Ritchie but then I'm thinking well that doesn't put Ritchie in front yeah we're here today to talk about how to use marmalade more effectively what we'll do is I have my marmalade screen open in case I need to show anything as you guys are talking right you know it's it's little but you guys can kind of see what's going on so all right so let's get right to the questions actually the first thing I wanted to talk about and I mentioned this to Gordon before Ritchie came in is the grades yes I could have pull up and not one person said I have a question about the grades nobody yes all right I have a question about other artists not a single question about the grades that is shocking I know not a single question my my question to you is for Etsy sellers why okay what purpose do the grades serve as far as your listings go to you guys because in what would I see all the time is people getting on they're getting so focused on the grades they lose sight of the fact that marma lead is amazing for finding good keywords and you kind of focus too much on one thing and leave the rest of it out but to me the value in marmelade is the keyword comparison and the search engagement all that all the stats on the keywords as much the grades for me personally I think that I think that if people are the type of people who go and do keyword research then they're interested in Craig's you know you want to get a good grade so if you guys can talk about how you see the grades fitting into the big picture first I would appreciate that yes absolutely and I like the way you put that because they really do fit into the big picture you can't really focus on any one thing you couldn't focus on just grades you can't focus on just sales because you won't know necessarily upstream of that what keywords be working for you and driving you traffic and all that stuff you can't focus on just visits because then you won't know well you know what listings are converting and stuff like that so any time you're picking any one thing and hyper focused on that you're losing sight of the big picture like Karis talking about so grades definitely aren't like the end-all be-all only thing you have to look at unfortunately like wouldn't that be nice if there was something that was super clear-cut and it's like this is my one thing but there's so many different factors that come into play what grades really are is an indicator of how well marma lead thinks your listing is set up for SEO on Etsy so they adhere to Etsy's guidelines that Etsy themselves put out and they kind of score your listings according to those guidelines so if you have a listing that's an a Marmalade thinks that you're set up pretty well from an SEO perspective on that listing based on what Etsy tells us is important and of course Etsy hope would hopefully be telling us that the right things are important for you know they want you guys to be successful so that they can be yeah so it all has to go back to that and it has to go you know we have to be able to point back to what ed sees recommending and stuff the grades are great if you're just getting started and you have no idea where to begin right we've had sellers who will come in tomorrow late and work on their grades and focus on that and then do well in the future their shop will do well so that it's great if you're not sure where to get started and what listings might need the most attention but to know what's working they're not a good indicator of that the best indicator of knowing which listings are performing and what keywords are performing for you is inside your Etsy stats now it's he doesn't share their stats data with us so we can't incorporate that information into Marmalade right now we totally would because I'd be really helpful to you as a Marmol eater to be able to look through and see which listings are performing better than other ones so if you want to get a good sense of what's working and which listings you should be working on based on ones that aren't getting visits or knowing which keywords on a specific listing are working better than other keywords and leaving those ones alone and swapping out some of your other keywords all of that information is in Etsy stats and K I'm sure Kerr has done a bunch of videos on that but she can point to for you too if you're interested in digging through your stats and making more sense of the data that Etsy shares with you in there so the grades are really just an indicator that you know you could be potentially doing better with SEO on a given listing or you really like you've nailed what Etsy is suggesting that you're doing with Etsy SEO on your listings okay can I ask one this isn't necessarily a grades thing I don't think but I'm just thinking of the interface with marmalade now and with when you guys went K when Etsy did their algorithm change with the contextual search normally took out the part that had the top ten listings for whatever keyword you're looking at just essentially it has nothing to do with grades but can you explain because I've told people this a million times from the source why did normally take out the top top performing listings when Betsy changed their algorithm yeah so when we not seem to change their algorithm around quite a bit it was after they acquired that AI technology from I think it was like Blackbird or whatever we used to show when we returned the results from Etsy where they were ranking and what spot they were ranking in and rank is kind of dead no I mean it's not kind of done it's super dead Leo was on the NC podcast I think and was even trying to drive home that rank you can't you use that as an indicator for anything you can obviously use visits and sales and things like that to look at hard numbers but looking at where you're ranking or where your listings are ranking or anything regarding where things are showing up in search results it's unreliable because you're seeing one thing someone else is seeing something completely different a third person seeing something completely different than the two of you and we've done tests with these and had different people do searches and even inside of you know the Facebook group and things like that people will say on I'm only showing up on page five and someone else is like what are you talking about you're on page one yeah it's it's not a good indicator at for how well you're doing for a keyword if that's what you're trying to measure the best place to do that again is in antsy stats they'll show you you can drill down to the listing level and see which keywords you're getting the most visits for so if you're concerned how well you're performing for a keyword in which keywords are giving you visits that's the best place to go look not you know switch to incognito and clear your cookies now that doesn't use your beeping in oh it's not gonna work it's all gimmicks and etsy is doing their best to try to figure out what the best products are to put in front of a single shopper so it's not like anyone who searches this here's what we're gonna deliver it's you know this person over here who you know it's this time of day they live in this part of the world we have this data already collected on them of other things that they're interested in here's what we want to put in front of them and it's going to be completely different than this other person over here at a different time of day you know that has clicked on other things or came to us through this channel or whatever it's all very very custom for what they're trying to show people all with the hopes of delivering the best match to each shopper and ending up when acquiring a sale yeah really I mean they're trying to create a boutique experience in a digital world so they're trying to take what they know about this person and say hey you might like this right in a marketplace of millions of items so that's what they're trained just like you're seeing chat box pop up all over the place and you talk to him those are trying to emulate a real-life person talking to you they're trying that's where all of the a is going is trying to make it seem like you have somebody there helping you and I could see in the future Etsy driving towards almost like a shopping assistant kind of thing and go to that kind of boutique experience because I would think that would be the ultimate in it if you could show up and as he knew what you like what your style was or what your you know you're trying to buy this type of thing for this kind of person they can go under their inventory of millions of items and they can come back with the handful that they think are perfect for you I mean that'd be pretty cool yeah so fill out your attributes everybody yeah I people still say I don't use attributes like now filled because that's what they're using it for you know they want to use those four filters all right now let's get to some questions okay so many Julie asks is it worth picking longtail keywords that have less than 25 views or engagement per month now this is actually an interesting question because just the way the longtail keywords work they get fewer views in search so maybe you guys can touch on that but that's the question is it worth picking longtail keywords that have less than 25 views or engagement per month all right so I'm gonna say it depends but probably not you probably don't want to be picking something with that few that low of engagement because chances are if they're getting 25 visits in a month you're gonna want to look at the level of competition for that keyword too but you know let's say there's a hundred listings that come back every time that someone does a search for that keyword and you're one of them you've got a 1% chance on average of being clicked for that keyword and if it's only happening 25 times a month you know that's like what a quarter of a percent that you're gonna you have a chance of getting a visit per month for that keyword so it's pretty low I would say mathematically that that you're gonna have success with that keyword now at the same time like it could be that those 25 people if if that's really nice for you and it works for your listings that you show up and you're always on page one and you build up credit for that keyword and you're getting 25 visits a month for that keyword like that's cool that's a cool thing the only way to really know is to dig into your stats so what I would do before applying that keyword is go through my stats and look at okay what are the keywords that are working for this listing that I'm considering putting this really low engagement keyword on start looking up some of those keywords and marmalade and seeing how they're scoring for engagement and for search and whether or not they're long tail and stuff like that take note of what the keywords look like that are currently working for you and then maybe dig up some of the ones the the keywords on your listings that aren't showing up in that table they're Etsy saying you're really not getting any visits for this keyword that's in your tags or your title or both and see what those look like and you'll get a good idea of what keywords will look appealing to you and which ones to kind of avoid so you can get a good sense of that it's gonna be different for every Shopp it's gonna be different for every market and stuff like that but if I had to give a yes/no on that one I would say avoid a keyword that's long tail that has less than 25 visits in less than 25 searches a month I agree with that with of course the caveat like you said if there are 25 searches for Thought engagement and you're looking for staff and you aren't picking those up and they're actually converting then absolutely go go for it I mean you've found yourself you know an outlier that you're winning with but for the most part even with a conversion rate of 10% which I'd say is very high if there were 25 searches for that keyword for entire month 10% means only two-and-a-half sales are actually coming from that keyword in an entire month yeah it's a good point over however many shots there are so as far as if math goes it just it's not real proud it doesn't sound promising okay let me let me ask you a clarifying question when because because I said that the question was is it worth picking longtail keywords okay now I think if if you're using that as one of your focused keywords which Marmalade calls focus keywords I call I don't call it that nevermind so marma lead refers to those as focused keywords so you're saying that you should not choose that as a focus keyword correct for you I wouldn't even necessarily use it in my tags or my title if it was seeing that low engagement now see I might because the the way that Etsy pops around because by the time you get to longtail keywords NC is hopping around they're not looking for the exact word order so like let's say it's I know that Gordon loves gnome houses it's his hobby hey give me give me a gnome house long tail keywords no no house furniture okay so let's say that you have no house furniture is a long tail keyword that gets less than 25 searches a month okay sounds like a good candidate for that yeah I think so probably so let's say I have no houses and I want to use furniture but since that's not really a good search engagement kind of keyword for a longtail I wouldn't use that nessarose my focus but I might throw furniture into the tags and then see if that gets picked up yeah so I wouldn't necessarily worry about the word order in that case but I might take furniture out and stick it in there and then use gnome house as the one that I match between my title and tags does that make sense to you I mean we're talking about something over multiple tags and and maybe using a tag for furniture and then another tag for gnome house to build out this longer tail keyword that's no house furniture that in turn doesn't get great engagement but it gets some that that makes some sense to me yeah but it would like you said depend on the competition for it it depends on yeah it depends on the competition and it depends if it's working for you too right like obviously you're gonna want to check back in your stats after a couple weeks or a month and if you're not getting any traction from that keyword combo that's a good candidate to try something else yeah okay and then someone else and this kind of goes along with this so can you put two short tail keywords together in a row in title and tags and have the same effect as a long tail keyword yes hundred percent yeah see that's I think that people don't understand that and that's that's the way that I do this I take I go into marmalade I put in I find good short tail keywords for search and engagement and I don't worry about the competition and after that I'll go in and add qualifiers or more adjectives or whatever you know to make that more of a niche search and at that point I don't worry about search and engagement but I just look at the competition mm-hmm so it's it part of it is that you have to use all three factors in different ways at different times to get good keywords and I think people get so focused on finding a good you know good longtail keyword that has high search engagement and low competition it's really hard to do yeah that's I like that method that makes a lot of sense and I think we can use the gnome house example with that too so what you could do with that in your example would be no mouse is a longtail key where that gets pretty decent engagement and searches on Etsy you could use that is like your main keyword right but then you have more descriptors like we're saying furniture while that could have crazy high competition combine that with known house if someone searching for gnome house furniture and you have it in your title and tags like you're gonna be a match for that if you have gnome house decor right or garden gnome house and you're using words like garden decor those are other words on etsy that are gonna have crazy competition and they're super generic but again they get combined when someone's doing a search for garden gnome house or no house decor which I don't know if anyone's ever done that but then you know you're building out these really niche things that are gonna be hyper focused on the shopper as they're typing things in which is what Etsy loves to see they love being able to pull back the most specific results that they can for someone and so when someone types something really specific into search that Z can deliver exactly what they're looking for so if you're using the keywords that your shoppers are using and building out combinations like carrots talking about I mean that's kind of an advanced thing to do for sellers and I can see why that would be confusing to a lot of people but that's a great strategy I find that a lot of people either like they don't believe in SEO and they just don't want to put any time and effort into it whatsoever because it's confusing and then the other camp is they're very very very rigid about and they're very strict and very specific and they're they're looking for very definite boxes to you know like well it has to be within this range of searches and engagement must be within this competition like you know things like that and then some of the questions about splitting things up we're focused on those areas where here I like that you're in that middle area right you're like well look this it's not as rigid as it sounds over here like you're over-reading into it it's over here in this little gray area and you found a way that makes it work and I'd also say as far as choosing keywords it so depends which is why we were talking about you know it's 25 is that enough and I mean dependent in the market 500 might not be right because all the different markets are different you know nose house furniture you might be for all the different things that you can use to describe gnome house furniture the employer world of the house furniture keywords might top out an object right so that might be as good as it gets for you is that much gnome house furniture keywords right right yes on slide right like or something trying to eat right like something that's just really you know known off the charts then all of a serie potter no houses yeah Harry Potter home houses you know now a sudden 100 or 500 that's nothing so it just really depends it's about picking the best of what's available yeah and yeah it does you know it the answer for everything is it depends on its line yeah it's kind of like real estate across the country right like it's an apartment in New York is gonna be way more expensive than an apartment like Oklahoma now the the most asked question when I put this little survey up is focused keywords and you guys can probably talk about that for about four hours but okay there's a question marmalade has a non focused keyword section when you're looking at your own listings okay and that's just below I should actually go into marmalade and find this while you guys are talking this says I'm guessing that these are keywords that are not in our titles and could we still be found for those which kind of relates to what we were just talking about – yeah yes yeah of course you can be found for anything that is in your titles or tags or attributes right it's it's possible to be found for this it's about raising your hand as enthusiastically as possible and say I'm the best fit for this keyword that's really all you're trying to do with everything is trying to tip the scales you're trying to say hey I've got a great shot full of Nome Alaska and I want to tip every scale I can towards I'm the best option for that when people are looking for it they come to my listing submit bio and therefore Etsy makes money because that's really kind of what's about right is Etsy is the sales on there the marketplace right they want to they want to move they want to they want to move profit where the new product is by showing shoppers what they want to buy and then those shoppers having a great experience so they come back into the store now I actually do have something for garden gnome house which is funny I'm looking at garden gnome house and I'm assuming that it's not popular tags similar shopper searches it might not even show up on this that's one thing does the screen and marmalade show different kind of stats and results depending on what you put in because I know that if you put in something that's not a longtail keyword it gives you suggestions correct okay let me do gnome house by itself because I'm not seeing on here I actually do have a couple of gnome house listings one is for a mold to make a gnome house set and one is for a gnome House cake decoration set everyone's gonna there's a woman down the street from me who has no house out in front of her house and I always slow down to look at it to see if she's put any more gnome house decor out there too so you won't see that list here if you need a search for like jewelry would probably generate a nice long time yeah that's true okay just reasons for you okay let's put in jewelry that's very general that's not a so I don't think that's gonna be a long tail keyword and most most of the questions that people have are about the focus keywords and how that works so after I do this and show that then I'll have you guys talked about the focus keyword so yeah this is not a long tail keyword okay but the reason for that and I'm not you know I've told you guys before I don't want to know your your secret mix of ingredients that you put into your formulas obviously I don't I don't want to know and I think you're going to tell me anyway but I'm assuming that that has something to do like the determination of long tail versus short tail is or not long tail is the combination of search engagement competition and other things that you put into it obviously jewelry is so general it's not gonna be long tail and that means that when you go down here okay so I do have a lot of listings with jewelry in it because people use my molds to make jewelry sometimes sample listings okay add into a longtail tag to make it even more niche right like no actually no house jewelry okay okay so if you if you get a keyword that is not a longtail you can scroll down and they show you longtail alternatives if you have a keyword that is a longtail this is not going to show up so that's why sometimes you see it sometimes you don't but as far as focused keywords go let me let me just look at one of my listings let's look at this one I don't know if you guys can see this this is I have no longtail focused keywords at all why don't you guys talk about how how Marmalade determines focus keywords and non focus keywords because I think that bothers people what we're looking at we go through all of your tags and if you have that tag in your title well now that's a focus keyword if that tag does not exist in your title it is not a focus keyword and then we go a step farther and you look at to tag combinations so that if you have two tags that you've put together like Nome house furniture right one tag is Nome house the other ones furniture that's actually and it exists in your title you have known house furniture in your title that's a focus keyword right it's when someone does a search for that Etsy is gonna find you as a strong match for that because you have it all in one string in your title and you have both of those in your tags that's that's like Richie's saying raising your hand like hey I'm a good match for this thing and we'll count that as a focus keyword also so not only is it direct tag to title matches for what keywords are in both to make kind of like this is something I want to focus on but it's also combinations of those for up to two tags so it's basically matching matching okay so if I find a really good keyword in Marmalade using the search engagement competition you know comparison tools and I want to use that in my Etsy title and tags you should so put it in your title and in your tags right yep it should be both right okay okay and someone asks why is gnome house a longtail keyword I thought longtail keywords were three or more words that's a very good question we've found words that are single word longtail keywords like aerospace so and other three word combinations like gift for her are not longtail and so when we were really looking into it we couldn't just look at how long a keyword was how many characters were in it or how many words were in it as the only way to indicate whether something was longtail or not so that's kind of why we had to combine a bunch of factors we use machine learning and built the model to determine it and everything's really fun stuff I awesome to actually do but there's a whole bunch of things that go into whether or not a keyword is longtail and it's gonna be different by market and it's gonna be different by a lot of things it's really a measure of how descriptive that keyword is so if someone walks into a shop and says hey I'm looking for an aerospace gift right you might you know assuming you're not walking into some sort of NASA gift shop right your space is gonna be pretty descriptive right like okay yeah there's a little section right over there in the shop and that's where you're gonna find a gift for your aerospace buddy if you walk into a women's boutique and you say hey I'm looking for a gift for her they're gonna be like great you're in the right place look around right it's not very discreet we've got some in our aerospace section okay and someone asks does the focus keywords have to be in the beginning of the title they do not they just need to be in your title somewhere to tell Etsy that you know that's more important than the keywords that aren't just in your tags you'll still match obviously if they don't you'll still match for a keyword but you'll be a better match if you have it in your title and in your tags it doesn't have to be at the beginning the last guide that Etsy released I think they said that the title position didn't matter as much anymore for Google SEO it still does you still want to put your most relevant relevant keywords at the front so you know consider that I would say if you're writing your titles on Etsy you want to make sure you're putting your most clearly descriptive things at the beginning so if you're a shopper going through a bunch of search results and you can only see the first four words because you're on a mobile device make sure those are very clearly describing what your listing is so that there's no confusion for them yeah and that's that's a right for the customer situation and I've always done that and I think that that's that's part of I think people get caught up with the search stats so much that you forget that there's a customer with the credit card not Etsy with the credit card you know so it's a two point situation you know oh yeah especially online where you can't pick things up and talk to them or whatnot right we're very keen to make sure that what we're buying that every step of the way we're validating we're getting right there right because no one wants to buy the wrong thing you know you yeah we buy you know you think you just bought a rocking chair scored a great deal on it it was only three dollars and then it arrives and it's this tall because it's where no mouse but you thought it was for a front porch you know front porch rocking chair you didn't notice that it's it's three inches tall and it's an Omaha special attraction right that's the kind of thing that that is where I think that's the kind of thing that worries people I don't know if it's real but a while ago I actually saw a post on Facebook where somebody posted something just like that they thought they got a great deal on something and it arrived in this tiny box and is actually a miniatures I think was for a dollhouse actually yeah but it was super realistic looking oh yeah I mean the gnome will really enjoy yeah okay with it I actually have $1.00 in my Anna I think but okay here's a question this this kind of goes to looking at the etsy stats and getting too focused in my opinion on the numbers but you guys might have some insight into this when I'm looking at Etsy stands for a month in my shop what number is a good number for that search keyword is seven enough to know if that keyword is working or is it a higher number I would look relative to the other keywords on your listing so I would go more by the like they'll show you what your highest s– visits are for a keyword and then it goes down from there for each and so for each listing what I would do is keep the ones that are my top three right and then try to play with the other ones below that maybe my top number one keyword is getting these seven visits that's not ideal but it's it's somewhere to start right I know that one's working ish at least compared to the others so I would start swapping out the ones below it to try to find ones that I think are gonna do better and then just keep you know keep doing that so like ideally you're gonna be finding keywords that will have more than seven visits a month and then more than thirty and then more than fifteen those keep you know improving the performance of that listing you can do the same thing in a listing level two and looking at saying okay which of my listings are getting the least number of visits and kind of drilling in that way – okay I don't I don't have like a hard number yeah there's no there's no hard number but it is all relative to your and I don't okay there's one thing I think that I should add to not this is anything you know when you go into your shop stats you guys you can also go into the listing and each listing has its own stats so you can see the listing keywords for that specific listing so don't you throw a lie on your entire shop set so you can go in and I think that I've mentioned that before and people are like where do I find that and you can either if you're signed in to your account go to the listing on your shop page and there's a little bar across the top that says edit copy delete whatever and you can see the stats there you know that's exactly where you want to go what keywords are working for that listing I wouldn't look at your ID let's see I think has a big keyword list that shows for your whole shop but that's not going to be a whole lot of help because you don't know which listings necessarily got visits from those so I like Hara saying go into this that specific listing stats and see what keywords are working for that one that you're working on this isn't really a marble you question any suggestions for a product like like toys that any search tends to bring up Disney related keywords are adult related keywords so I would say a good strategy for something where it's kind of like let's say toys for example toys this is a good example if you're struggling to come up with good keywords that longtail keywords table the carriages showed inside the mom lead is a good option so like put in jewelry if you don't know where to go put in toys if you don't know where to go from there and it'll come up with a bunch of you know high performing longtail suggestions that are related to the keyword that you typed in and you know you can even do a storm if you want take one of those keywords that you find or a handful of those and start some storms in sytem rmally to get more keyword ideas from those so if you're if you're in the space like toys or art or something like that and you're just paintings you're just really struggling to say like I can think of like three ways to describe this that's a good place to start is to is to throw it into marmalade and look at that long tail suggestions table for some ideas for kind of like more descriptive avenues to use and like I just pulled up the storm feature I love the store feature because you can't put I put toys in here and it's coming up with adult toys and things you probably don't want but it has all kinds of ideas and I don't know if you guys know this but if you might cross something out and then you add something it adds things down at the bottom of the list so the more specific you get here by Xing out things and by adding things to the list that applies to your listing normally gives you more suggestions at the bottom of the list every single time you add something so it's that's a really good place to go to get ideas just to start from and since you can see the marma meters in there you know green or red it gives you kind of a quick thumbnail glance if that's gonna be a good road to go down and I've actually used this to do my product development because sometimes I'll see something I was like I didn't know that keyword existed but it's all green I can make some things like that you know I'll say that's been smart to do it for market research and build products that people are actually looking for because a lot of times people will make something and then they scramble to find a market where someone's gonna buy it that part's a lot harder yeah it's you got to kind of meet in the middle yeah yeah it's a lot easier to make something with the audience is already there and you don't have to find your audience oh okay then someone said you said Harry Potter gnome houses you can't use Harry Potter and a tag correct no you cannot that's a that's copyrighted trademarked don't do it yeah even though people are searching for like crazy like if you go to the popular searches section Marmalade it'll it's almost always in the top ten so slime there's a bunch of other words that show up there a whole bunch but yeah copyrighted words er no no okay go go says I struggle finding good any kind of like good keywords for embroidery and even storm doesn't help very much she says just saying but I love you all so it can be tough sometimes right it's it's really tough when you're stuck in a rut with things there's a few things you can try if you for your shoot we're super stuck there's always you know other places to go and look for keywords and see how people are describing those things obviously we talked about the longtail table inside a marmalade on the storm and stuff like that but if you go through those and you're still you know just not happy with the words that you're seeing you don't feel like they're a great fit for you you know you could ask some friends like just show them one of your listings and say how would you describe this to me like what is what is this to you or a game you can play with people is to describe it yourself to them but have like a list of words that you're not going to use when you describe it so like don't use the word embroidery when you're describing it to them and see like how you're getting them to say it or or understand what you're describing to them without using those words and then pay attention to the words that you're using when you do that because you're gonna start getting more kind of creative to kind of talk around what you're what you're trying to come up with and not to say that those are going to be good keywords like the keywords that your friends are giving you or that you're using to describe it that aren't just embroidery you still want to test those in met those and see like okay is that a legit way of describing this thing and make sure they're good before you slap him on your listing agreed somebody recently mentioned that question but okay we regardless if I was talking to you they said that a lot of times they'll find in their stats things that they didn't expect that their shoppers were searching for and they're like what should I do about that and I was like well that's great information from them they'll put back into my relief and use that stuff that they're finding you for and selling that you didn't expect then go find more like that just keep going back to what's working and try to find more things like that that are working instead of trying to reinvent the wheel yeah you can also approach your descriptions from different directions too you don't have to describe exactly what it is or what it's made from think about how people are using it or what need they're trying to fulfill them when they're purchasing it if it's a gift for someone if it's for a special occasion or if it's for certain uses or certain seasons or something like that that anything that might be a driver for this is a good candidate for what this person is looking for and they don't always search based on saying you know I don't know I want an embroidered hat or something like that or an embroidered backpack like it could be like a back-to-school thing or something like that you know and you're showing up for that and they go yeah I should get like a weird monogrammed backpack or whatever it could be anything like that so truck don't don't always you know funnel yourself down a certain path you can you can approach it from different angles to with but the ways you're describing it okay next question now this is this is more like a structural thing on normally that Stacey was asking is there a way to see and this is you know when you put in the comparison tool I have it up on the screen a really long phrase and you just can't see the whole thing what would it be a possible future feature that you could get rid of one of these columns so that these would be wider and then just have three on there so you could see the whole thing or is that something that you guys can't do here by a wider now in all seriousness we this people have suggested this before and it sits on our feature list of things to implement down the road we're working on some other stuff right now but I wouldn't that's it's that's also on the list of things that yes people have asked for that and it makes sense and we can definitely solve that whether we you know make the columns a little wider or make it go multi row or shrink the text size down a little bit if it's a longer keyword because I can see where that would be a pain you're trying to compare these things and especially when the specific word is at the end that makes them different and they all start the same it gets a little confusing to try to sort of how it was in column two again yeah so it's on the list of things for us to look at see I'm very excited when you say we're working on new things like new things I know I know that you see but now that's that's one thing that I will say about marmalade is you work on new things that are useful and are not like shiny objects I'm gonna chase down that path and waste my time so that's what I like about normally you know thanks Kari we try to okay it's actually useful and not distracting the main thing that people were asking about was the focus keywords so I think you guys addressed that yeah hopefully that makes sense now so I guess we can go through it again real quick and that's just that there's three tables on your listing detail page you've got your focus keywords at the top and then on focus and then all your tags so starting at the bottom your tags are your tags they're all your tags that you put on your listing and we show you the scores for each of your tags the next table up is that non focus keyword so those are tags that don't exist anywhere in your title that's really simple and then that next table up is your tags that do exist in your table and it includes two tag combos that also exist in your title to do things like what Kara was saying gnome house furniture right if those were two separate tags those that would show as a focus keyword even though in and of itself you don't have gnome house furniture in a tag by itself it's two separate ones it still shows as a focused keyword okay so this is this is a should have bar believe that I do not frequent very often I really don't pay attention to the grades I'm use I'm all in it for the for the SEO research you know the keywords in that kind of thing so when they're asking me about this I'm like what are you talking about because I just don't go here so this is this is oh it's in the listings when you click on my listings and go to the individual one it tells you all the things now here's here's a question descriptions and photos aren't yet part of SC SEO so they're not included in your grade okay are any of these things included in the grades or is it just it is there to help you with you know sales and converting users and things like that but it's maybe like a nice to have kind of section if you're really trying to hone in on things the title part where we kind of break down your title a little bit I think that's super useful to see what your title looks like on their mobile app and not only in search results but also when someone drills into your listing there because Etsy in those last round of you know SEO suggestions has talked kind of a decent amount about clear and concise titles and I think this is what they're getting at when they talk about that they're seeing more and more mobile traffic from shoppers coming in and they want to make sure that titles really make sense on in you know to those people that are shopping that way and this is a quick way to kind of do a spot check of your titles and see does this make sense if someone only sees this part of my title are they gonna know what this is if they're only looking at this you see I didn't even know that was there that's very useful but it's not graded but it's very useful yeah yeah no I agree you have to put the most important thing in so yeah I did I did not know that that was there because I don't look at the Greg see I learned something today you guys so the focused keywords would be keywords that are in both title and tags non-fun has crazy number of focus keywords right like the fewer focused keywords you have the easier it's going to be to make sure you're picking high-quality ones so don't stress yourselves oh it's like oh my god I only have three focused keywords here like that's okay like three is a good number of focus keywords to have in your listing don't feel like you got to blow that table up and have 13 focused keywords because you've got 13 tags you need to creatively craft a title that somehow incorporates all of them like don't kill yourself over that you know okay and then the non focus keywords are keywords that are there but aren't necessarily in both places yeah they're in your tags but they're not something that like Ritchie was saying you'd be raising your hand for saying I'm a really strong match for this keyword you'll still match for it right anything that's in your non focused keywords it's in your tags and it is a keyword and you'll still match it if someone does a search for that on etsy but depending on how many results there are and depending what your competition looks like and how much credit they have built up for that specific keyword that you were a match for that's all going to affect your placement in search results and so you're not going to have as much of a strength for your non focused keywords as you do for your focused keywords which is okay okay these are these are the tags down here they don't make sense my tags don't necessarily make sense I match the ones that I really want to match but I don't worry about the rest and so it's like polymer clay pmc that's not there because someone is going to search for that it's there to give Etsy the words in case someone does a long term a long tail search for polymer you know gaming dice for polymer clay you know and then it'll find me this is a good example I mentioned to the if you scroll back down to your tags type table down there yeah so there's some keywords that have dots and numbers next to them and some keywords that don't have anything next to them the fact that there is nothing in a row for a keyword doesn't mean that it's not a long tail and it doesn't mean that it has poor searches and poor engagement it simply means that that search has never been done inside of Marmalade so we don't know how many results there are on Etsy for that keyword yet because we don't have a complete picture of the data for that keyword we don't show anything it shows blank so if you want to fill those in you could go through and click the keyword it'll do a search inside of Marmalade and then if you refresh your shop listings like controller or or whatever you'll see that data start to fill in and you'll see data for those keywords so if you see a keyword with nothing there don't freak out it's no big deal it just means that we simply have no information on how many search results there are for that keyword yet okay and since everything is live links you can just click on it and it'll do the work for you you don't have to flit around new categories yeah okay so if I go back and refresh this I would have to refresh the whole thing right yeah let's do that cuz that should bring that up that's that's good to know because I have had people ask me that I'm like I don't know yeah there was another question in a Facebook group about that a couple days ago why I'm white it's cuz I'm not clicking on the right thing all right let me see if there's any more questions Neal just joined she says I'm curious that the numbers of search engagement showed the last 30 days or current recent everyday search engagement numbers that's a very good question that's a fantastic question yes and we would love to talk about that so the search and engagement numbers that you're looking at are a rolling future 30 days so it's we're taking all of the data from like the past 14 months and we're doing some forecasting for what we think this keywords going to do in the future so when you see your search number there and your engagement number there that's the expected searches and engagement for the next 30 days and it's not like the next this month or the next month or it cuts over if I'm looking at it at the 15th of the month it's how many searches and engagement do we expect to see based on past performance of this keyword for the next 30 days from that point and this is important because when you're picking keywords you don't want to be looking at you know how many searches something had last month because it could be over like that could be it it might have just been a Christmas rush and you're picking awesome keywords based on how something did last month you really want to be looking at how things are going to do and Richie's got a fantastic weather analogy that I'm sure he can share about this too right yeah as far as what you know weather goes you wouldn't pick what you're going to wear today based on the average of the weather last week and you wouldn't use winter season to decide how you're going to dress or plan for the summer right assume you live somewhere that's not San Diego because I understand there that it's the same like every single day every day of the year but if you live somewhere with four seasons right it's gonna be very very very different so think of it like weather forecasting you know if it says snow is coming but it was 80 degrees yesterday I put I put a coat on yeah and just like the weather at sea seasonal so there's definitely different seasons that end up being popular for different keywords and stuff like that the forecasting takes all that into consideration so but because it's seasonally you couldn't like look back at you know last February and say well here's how it did last February this is definitely how it's gonna do this February it's a little more complicated than that but it's definitely like a it's a rolling window and it's always thirty days in the future so you can you know that you're picking key words that are expected to perform a certain way not ones that already have performed a certain way that's a great point too because I forgot about that part year to year right winter summer all those things are gonna be different here in North Carolina we set a record for rainfall for the fall and it was terrible and it was nothing like last year so you really can't assume that year to year nothing new has changed so that's why the forecasting looking forward so important right and especially the next 30 days you actually have some time to jump on and back in back to the last thing about the tags I did refresh the screen and now it's showing the statistics for that keyword that I did not have this didn't have anything here before so if you guys miss that if you're in your tags there's no data Ritchie and Gordon's say just click on this it'll take you to that it'll do a search in Marmalade and then you can refresh your listings – it'll show up for every single keyword your search you could go through to a listing and you know click to do a search click to do a search click fill out your whole table and then refresh and then all of them will show up and the nice thing too is if you're using that keyword across multiple listings it'll benefit all those listings so they'll all fill in that's a question do you do you guys recommend use the same keywords and multiple listings if you find a good one yeah within a reason I wouldn't go crazy and use the same keyword on all of my listings I think it's wise to sprite to spread a wide net over your listings and your keywords but I wouldn't hesitate to use it on a handful of listings you know agree yeah I wouldn't put it like you know Gordon said I wouldn't put it across like 20 listings or something like that the chances of populating the front of you know like the actual in practice type it in and the shopper is just displayed with 20 of your listings for that it is very unlikely so yeah it spread it out for sure every keyword is an opportunity so the more good keywords you have the more opportunities the more reasons people have to show up into your shop and on that note with that thought every keyword is an opportunity we've hit about an hour so I'm going to let you guys go because that was very nice of you to do this for no reason except that I asked them you know yeah if you get if you if the people in this group if you have more questions you can go join the Marmalade Facebook group if you haven't and you can post questions there they're very helpful over there and there's also I here's here's something where what address if you just go to marmalade comm where do people go to find the knowledgebase is that on the blog marmalade come forward slash help we'll take you there our lead com forward slash help ah look at this so marmalade com forward slash help and there's advise and answers from the marmalade team and do you still have all those videos up or is that all on the blog I know that you've got all of the YouTube videos if you want to watch the YouTube channel there's a lot of places to go for answers and you know if you don't get an answer in the if it's something like technical then probably the knowledge base will be better but if you have specific questions about SEO using marmalade go join the Facebook group you can post them there and you guys have anything else to add that you want to add you could email success at marmalade calm and we're happy to field your questions there too but yeah Kara is a fantastic resource for you guys – she knows her stuff she's got a bunch of videos out there on YouTube and so you're in good hands with somebody who knows exactly what they're doing and is in it and trying things every day I've got a great leader except I apparently didn't know that you could look at the mobile title in the marmalade so on a mobile device though right so okay all right but I will talk to you guys later and thank you very much I really appreciate it okay bye have a good day bye all right you too